Elusive Galadriel asks in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: Does anyone have any comments in reference to the enforcing of non thievs killing thieves on guild property?

Suddenly and without warning, a no. 7 throwing knife flies out of the shadows towards Elusive Galadriel, but she dodges out of the way at the last instant. She peers around, trying to locate the origin of the shot.

Elusive Galadriel looks around for a bit, peering into shadows, but apparently doesn't find whatever she was looking for.

Elusive Galadriel says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: OH nice. :P

Lexx Rehevkor says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: How ironic.. :P

Furtive FirAmOS Le Marc says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: Great, getting inhumed as soon as it starts :)

Dodgy Igorken Pugionis starts to search around.

Dodgy Igorken Pugionis searches around the place a bit.

Shifty Stickgod struts proudly around the room.

Elusive Dirklurk starts to search around.

Shifty Stickgod flexes his muscles.

Elusive Dirklurk searches around the place a bit.

Elusive Galadriel says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: Nice. Very nice.

Furtive FirAmOS Le Marc starts to search around.

Furtive FirAmOS Le Marc searches around the place a bit.

DantheMan Dominare puts the pair of iron gauntlets in a pocket in the black backpack.

DantheMan Dominare gets a pair of chocolate gauntlets from a pocket in a black backpack.

Mimer gets a silver ring from a pocket in a utility belt.

Evasive Akaishi says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: a bit unsporting I'd think

Mimer wears a silver ring.

Shifty Stickgod says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: a bit dum too

Elusive Dirklurk starts to search around.

Elusive Galadriel says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: Very inappropriate. Anyway, I'll continue even if I get inhumed. S'rrelevant. :P

Elusive Dirklurk searches around the place a bit.

Mross says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: i mainly worry about people killing the fences.

Someone throws a throwing knife at Elusive Galadriel and it hits her in the throat!

Elusive Galadriel dies.

To the south, the bell of the Assassins' Guild clock tolls once, signifying another successful inhumation.

Faye Fi Fo Fam says with a Genuan accent: can't be that dumb... I still dont see a dead assassin.

The ghost of Galadriel says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: There we go. :P

Mr Scruffy says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: no biggie

Mentalist DemonWynd mourns the ghost of Galadriel.

DantheMan Dominare starts to search around.

Mimer starts to search around.

Lexx Rehevkor puts down a thief's dagger from his left hand.

Lexx Rehevkor holds an impstomatic in his left hand.

DantheMan Dominare searches around the place a bit.

Elusive Dirklurk says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: I guess you can't get interrupted now.

Lexx Rehevkor presses the button on the impstomatic. A squeak of delight comes from it.

Mimer searches around the place a bit.

You can hear a scritching noise coming from Lexx Rehevkor's impstomatic.

There seems to be some sort of swishing noise coming from Lexx Rehevkor's impstomatic.

With an ungracious "ker-flup" a small picture falls out of the bottom of Lexx Rehevkor's impstomatic.

Lexx Rehevkor puts down an impstomatic from his left hand.

Lexx Rehevkor holds a thief's dagger in his left hand.

Faye Fi Fo Fam grins at Lexx Rehevkor.

Sultan Githan draws the iron short sword from one of the short sword scabbards into his left hand.

Sultan Githan draws the platinum short sword from one of the short sword scabbards into his right hand.

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: knives

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: so not Dane, and not Fayte

Faye Fi Fo Fam says to Lexx Rehevkor with a Genuan accent: That's real classy, Lexx...

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: who both use fired

The ghost of Galadriel says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: Anyway. Yes. Ok, Non-thieves killing thieves on guild property. I'd just like to get a feel over whether this is an issue that should be covered in the non AM guilds as well.

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: I want to say Rumatha :p

Mr Scruffy says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: well, I reckon that with the expection of inhumations and the enforcers there's no reason for any killing of any sort to go unpunnished

Lexx Rehevkor grins at Faye Fi Fo Fam.

Sultan Githan grins.

Evasive Akaishi says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: I say yes. The mad stoat guild's become a bit of a tourist attraction

Ms Creation Iniquitous says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: yeah wizards come in ans slaughter everything :(

Mross asks in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: if people want to enter our guildhouse, why should we make it easy for them to garner xp?

Lexx Rehevkor puts the iconograph in a pocket in the close-fitting black leather bag.

Mimer says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: if we want to keep the guild together, theres no reason to exclude the other guild houses

Furtive FirAmOS Le Marc says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: Rumatha is probably the only one not grouped or busy, and capable.

Quiet Cull de Sac wears a silver book locket.

Faye Fi Fo Fam asks Mimer with a Genuan accent: does that include the "rogues" npcs or just Dodgy Bill and Ceramon?

Creation has reconnected.

Faye Fi Fo Fam says to Furtive FirAmOS Le Marc with a Genuan accent: it doesnt matter, whoever it was was just doing their job.

The ghost of Galadriel nods at Mimer.

Flatline Debonaire says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: Yeah, as long as there is just the AM thieves guild, then all guild houses belongs to the guild, in my npk-opinion.. If the split (tm) ever comes, that's another issue.

Lexx Rehevkor asks in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: Are we talking player thieves, NPCs or both?

The ghost of Galadriel says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: Both.

The ghost of Galadriel says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: The main issue is player thieves though.

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: Personally, I would say that PK thieves should be protected in thief-only areas of all guilds.

Honest Greyko von Gypsy says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: People coming in and killing the fences, etc is a problem though.

Sultan Githan says in Thieves' Cant with a Djelian accent: Err, Mad Stoad.

Sultan Githan says in Thieves' Cant with a Djelian accent: I would say that the rogues aren't really thief npcs, just questionable characters who hang out on our Bar in Sto.

Sultan Githan says in Thieves' Cant with a Djelian accent: Stoat.

Sultan Githan sobs quietly.

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: Meaning behind the guard thieves in AM, the bottom area of the mad stoat guild, etcetera.

The ghost of Galadriel nodnods at DantheMan Dominare.

Mr Scruffy says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: the rogues in mad stoat are a bit of a strange case though, those country bumpkins are hardly thieves andhow, they just sit around drinking and attacking non thieves

Sultan Githan nods at Mr Scruffy.

Faye Fi Fo Fam agrees with Mr Scruffy wholeheartedly.

Elusive Dirklurk says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: It's a little much to have players killing the fences. Particularly in guilds where this only one fence present.

Dodgy Igorken Pugionis stares intently into space for a bit.

Evasive Akaishi says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: they're behind a trapdoor that's supposedly hidden to non-thieves

Dodgy Mohvati Casaubon arrives from below.

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: Consider that the bandit leader's tent in Bandit Camp is technically one of our guilds too :p

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: We can advance there :p

A handsome sheep shearer lands with a thump on the floor beside you.

The handsome sheep shearer says with a Morporkian accent: G'day, the ghost of Galadriel. Astromene L'Femmes sent me to cheer you up.

Nyoink Quixonte grins.

DantheMan Dominare manages to get around the handsome sheep shearer's defences and launches a vicious attack.

DantheMan Dominare catches the handsome sheep shearer by surprise. DantheMan Dominare stabs his Decay right through the handsome sheep shearer's left leg.

DantheMan Dominare slashes at the handsome sheep shearer with his Demise but despite the surprise, although unable to defend, he somehow avoids the attack.

DantheMan Dominare catches the handsome sheep shearer by surprise. DantheMan Dominare stabs his Decay right through the handsome sheep shearer's right arm.

DantheMan Dominare dealt the death blow to the handsome sheep shearer.

DantheMan Dominare tidies up the place, clearing away the corpse of a handsome sheep shearer.

Furtive FirAmOS Le Marc giggles.

Lexx Rehevkor mutters under his breath.

Sultan Githan rolls his eyes.

The ghost of Galadriel says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: Efficient. :P

Faye Fi Fo Fam asks DantheMan Dominare with a Genuan accent: Wasn't that a little overkill?

Dodgy Igorken Pugionis grumbles.

Nyoink Quixonte shrugs.

Sythyr says with a Genuan accent: Kiss of death would have been more so.

Sythyr grins mischeviously.

Nyoink Quixonte says with a Genuan accent: Better than leaving them alive.

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: So anyway, yes - that's what I think :p

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: As for NPCs, I'd say it is only worth us covering NPCs we actually need.

Sultan Githan says in Thieves' Cant with a Djelian accent: It's one thing to kill npcs who work in the guild, but those who just hang out shouldn't deserve our protection.

The ghost of Galadriel asks in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: Anyway, back to the matter at hand. So people generally think that thieves, both players and NPCs should be protected in all thieves' guilds, yes?

Sultan Githan says in Thieves' Cant with a Djelian accent: I don't see the point of extending protection to non unique, non functional npcs, including the rogues, bandits, and so on.

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: So that excludes the mad stoat rogues, AM heavies, etcetera.

Sultan Githan nods at DantheMan Dominare.

Lexx Rehevkor says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: NPCs in the guild should defiantly be protected somehow, they're employees after all. But I'm not so sure about players, in public areas anyway.

Evasive Akaishi asks in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: the bandits attack us though, like the ones in the shades do. We don't protect them do we?

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: I think the bandits are a special case - was just mentioning them as a point of interest :p

Dodgy Igorken Pugionis stares intently into space for a bit.

Mr Scruffy nodnods at DantheMan Dominare.

Honest Greyko von Gypsy says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: well, apparently in the AM guild there's coded protection, I just haven't seen it work for a long time.

Mross says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: the guildhouse is sacred ground, as far as i am conerned.

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: My logic is that some of our public areas have resources for other guilds - and therefore there are valid reasons for them to be there.

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: Whereas it will be much easier to divine the intent of a non-thief PK in one of the restricted areas.

DantheMan Dominare sweats.

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: There's no reason for them to be there apart from to cause some kind of trouble :)

Faye Fi Fo Fam nods at DantheMan Dominare.

Mimer asks in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: so, the whole of the AM guild for npc, and protected parts of all guild houses for players and npc outside of AM guild?

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: So *I* believe it would make enforcing this policy easier :p

Sultan Githan agrees with Mimer wholeheartedly.

Lexx Rehevkor agrees with Mimer wholeheartedly.

Sythyr agrees with Mimer wholeheartedly.

Sultan Githan shrugs at DantheMan Dominare.

DantheMan Dominare grins at Sultan Githan.

Elusive Dirklurk agrees with Mimer wholeheartedly.

The ghost of Galadriel agrees with Mimer wholeheartedly.

Elusive Dirklurk spends a moment in thought with his head bowed.

The ghost of Galadriel says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: One second, will be right back. :P

Sythyr asks with a Genuan accent: What about vital NPCs in "unprotected" areas, like Noturious Jones in Bes Pelargic?

The ghost of Galadriel leaves down.

Sythyr says with a Genuan accent: It's a rather long trip to the next nearest fence.

Elusive Dirklurk says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: It's guild property, so I think this would cover that.

Light-fingered Koryo asks in Thieves' Cant with a Bes Pelargic accent: hes in a guildhouse isnt he?

Evasive Akaishi says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: I kinda wish there was more to the bp guild in the first place

Nyoink Quixonte nods.

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: Well, Mimer's suggestion would cover Jones I think :p

Mross asks in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: this doesn't cover ilik, does it?

Shifty Stickgod nodnods.

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: Ilik is not a Thief

Nyoink Quixonte asks with a Genuan accent: Ilik is fair game, isn't he?

Faye Fi Fo Fam says with a Genuan accent: nothing covers Ilik. ;)

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: he's a thief

Honest Greyko von Gypsy says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: well, with npcs, we can really only protect those in the AM guild if the offender is npk.

Sultan Githan says in Thieves' Cant with a Djelian accent: No, Ilik's a renegade, and I'd imagine our policy will stay the same.

Lexx Rehevkor grins at DantheMan Dominare.

Elusive Dirklurk says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: I think Ilik is an exception.

Mross says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: good.

Elusive Simidhel von Helsing arrives from below.

Nyoink Quixonte tips his hat at Elusive Simidhel von Helsing stylishly.

Shifty Stickgod greets Elusive Simidhel von Helsing.

Sythyr welcomes Elusive Simidhel von Helsing.

Sultan Githan says in Thieves' Cant with a Djelian accent: Our GM will be back with us shortly.

Elusive Galadriel arrives from below.

Sultan Githan grins.

Honest Greyko von Gypsy beeps happily at Elusive Galadriel.

Sythyr exclaims with a Genuan accent: Wow, that -was- shortly!

DantheMan Dominare sweats.

Nyoink Quixonte grins.

Shifty Stickgod cheers enthusiastically.

Dodgy Mohvati Casaubon grins.

Elusive Galadriel says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: Sorry about that, just needed to get some 'refreshment'. :P

Sythyr dries DantheMan Dominare with a blue hand towel.

Nyoink Quixonte says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: She aint a thief for nothin'.

Mross says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: i do think that the same rules should apply to other guild's houses.

Elusive Galadriel gets a small gilt-edged card from the corpse of Galadriel.

Elusive Galadriel reads the small gilt-edged card.

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: Here, I got you something :)

DantheMan Dominare gives a no. 5 throwing knife and a no. 7 throwing knife to Elusive Galadriel.

Ms Creation Iniquitous asks in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: yeah protection for NPC in the guild area?

Elusive Dirklurk says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: How strong are the guards anyway? If they're going to be functioning as actual guards for the NPCs perhaps they need to be beffed up.

Sultan Githan says in Thieves' Cant with a Djelian accent: The guards in the AM guild? Attacking them gets you thrown in the rat pit, afaik.

Sultan Githan says in Thieves' Cant with a Djelian accent: I tested the other day with an alt.

Elusive Dirklurk says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: *beefed

Honest Greyko von Gypsy says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: protecting npcs in any guild other than AM will only work with pks, I don't think there's a huge amount we can do there.

Honest Greyko von Gypsy says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: Not sure it still does Githan, saw a priest attacking one a few weeks ago and nothing happened.

Sultan Githan says in Thieves' Cant with a Djelian accent: Until sanction returns, at which point we'll have a good deal of flexibility to deal with that sort of thing.

DantheMan Dominare nodnods.

Furtive FirAmOS Le Marc asks in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: What exactly is sanctioning?

Dodgy Mohvati Casaubon gets a black leather trench coat from a pocket in a close-fitting black leather bag.

Dodgy Mohvati Casaubon wears a black leather trench coat.

DantheMan Dominare stares intently into space for a bit.

Elusive Dirklurk says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: Perhaps they can call for reinforcements- i.e. multiple guards called to assist one under attack.

Evasive Akaishi removes the ebony faced watch.

Mross says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: that's a good idea.

Evasive Akaishi puts the ebony faced watch in a pocket in the black linen cloak.

Elusive Dirklurk spends a moment in thought with his head bowed.

Sultan Githan says in Thieves' Cant with a Djelian accent: We'll find out when it returns to the game! But basically, it's a variety of punishments that the admin can call onto players.

Sythyr says to Furtive FirAmOS Le Marc with a Genuan accent: The application of selected punishments to a player, enacted by code instead of PKing, and called for by the GM/AGM/Monitors. Perhaps.

Mross says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: you could also put them at 'don't-even-think-about-it'.

Sultan Githan says in Thieves' Cant with a Djelian accent: Well, the guards _should_ throw you in the rat pit for fighting them, unless it's broken.

Furtive FirAmOS Le Marc asks in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: Does it affect all players, not just PKs?

Elusive Simidhel von Helsing says with a Morporkian accent: and one that has been suggested many times over the 10 years I think >;-)

Sythyr says to Furtive FirAmOS Le Marc with a Genuan accent: Yes.

Dodgy Igorken Pugionis asks in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: Didn't Trilogy hint that there were some new minor piunishments? Or did I misread that?

Mimer says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: there is sopposed to be a broader range of the punishments ya

Nyoink Quixonte gets a Thieves' Guild Licence from a pocket in a close-fitting black leather bag between opening and closing it.

Elusive Galadriel says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: Aye, as Mimer said.

Honest Greyko von Gypsy says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: there's a menu of punishments, i just dont think they're active yet

Nyoink Quixonte briefly consults the Thieves' Guild Licence.

Sultan Githan says in Thieves' Cant with a Djelian accent: There will be a range of punishments.

Nyoink Quixonte opens a pocket in the close-fitting black leather bag.

Nyoink Quixonte puts the Thieves' Guild Licence in a pocket in the close-fitting black leather bag.

Nyoink Quixonte closes a pocket in the close-fitting black leather bag.

Elusive Simidhel von Helsing asks with a Morporkian accent: will we get to know what they are or will this be kept within the confidence of the guild admin only?

Dodgy Igorken Pugionis exclaims in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: ah, not active yet, thought they were, nevermind!

Sultan Githan asks in Thieves' Cant with a Djelian accent: anyone have any final thoughts on the issue of protection in guild houses?

Mimer says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: talking about beefing up the npc is probably something best left to idea reports to coders though, as the guild admin cant really control that

DantheMan Dominare nods emphatically at Mimer.

Evasive Akaishi says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: I would think once they were used the story would get around quickly

Honest Greyko von Gypsy says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: not for me personally to say, but i imagine we'll make it public what the punishments are, and what we'd consider them usable for.

Mr Scruffy shakes his head.

Elusive Simidhel von Helsing nodnods.

Nyoink Quixonte says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: There will always be people who try to push the punishment boundaries.

Sythyr says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: Trilogy's been looking for a place to put a record of them, too, so I wouldn't be surprised if someone were to sneak in and do a bit of research on the past sanctionings anyway.

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: I think it might be a more effective deterrant if people did *not* know what might happen to them, personally :p

Sultan Githan says in Thieves' Cant with a Djelian accent: Basically what's been suggested is extending some sort of protection to the functional npcs in all of our guilds, and protecting players in the thief only areas of our guilds, provided they aren't abusing the "safe house" priviledges.

Sythyr grins at DantheMan Dominare.

Mimer nodnods at DantheMan Dominare.

Elusive Galadriel grins at DantheMan Dominare.

Sultan Githan says in Thieves' Cant with a Djelian accent: We'll deal with sanction when we know more about it :)

Elusive Dirklurk nodnods at Sultan Githan.

Light-fingered Koryo says in Thieves' Cant with a Bes Pelargic accent: it might be awkward, if we arent careful there'll be another row over it i reckon

Dodgy Mohvati Casaubon says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: Once people were punished with any given method it would be known about, though.

DantheMan Dominare asks in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: So, uh.. next item?

Sultan Githan grins at DantheMan Dominare.

DantheMan Dominare exclaims in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: 25 minutes gone already!

Elusive Galadriel says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: Right.

Elusive Dirklurk spends a moment in thought with his head bowed.

Furtive FirAmOS Le Marc says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: How long will this last? :)

Sultan Githan exclaims in Thieves' Cant with a Djelian accent: Until it's over!

Simidhel goes white, looks very chalky and turns into a statue.

Evasive Akaishi exclaims in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: longer'n an all day sucker!

Furtive FirAmOS Le Marc grins.

Simidhel has reconnected.

DantheMan Dominare says to Furtive FirAmOS Le Marc in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: Why, you have a luncheon appointment perhaps? :)

Mross says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: it ain't over till it's over! or my wife tells me to get offline.

Sultan Githan says in Thieves' Cant with a Djelian accent: oer, galadriel is nekkid.

Elusive Galadriel says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: sorry, connection's going dodgy.

Nyoink Quixonte blinks.

Elusive Galadriel says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: Oi. :P

Evasive Akaishi ogles at himself. How odd.

Evasive Akaishi blinks.

Dodgy Mohvati Casaubon gasps in astonishment at Elusive Galadriel.

Elusive Galadriel exclaims in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: Don't all act surprised!

Furtive FirAmOS Le Marc says to DantheMan Dominare in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: I do have stuff I need ot be getting on with, but this is more important, for now. :)

Light-fingered Koryo says in Thieves' Cant with a Bes Pelargic accent: and there goes the rest of the meeting ;)

Elusive Galadriel asks in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: Anyway. Yes. The situation if for example a PK thief steals from another. Are they allowed their own retribution?

Myndes has been idle for too long; he vanishes in a puff of boredom.

Shifty Stickgod says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: yes

Faye Fi Fo Fam says to Elusive Galadriel with a Genuan accent: no.

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: Tough one.

Myndes Felin enters the game.

Ms Creation Iniquitous chuckles.

Myndes Felin spends a moment in thought with his head bowed.

Evasive Akaishi asks in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: how do you police that? just ask the players involved for logs?

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: I've been thinking about this.

Furtive FirAmOS Le Marc says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: I reckon they should be allowed to relatiate if stolen from or attacked, but should be able to do as they wish if provoked.

Myndes Felin sits on a bench.

Elusive Dirklurk says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: I think that it is reasonable for the PK thief to enact retribution, or refer the matter to the guild, but not both.

Furtive FirAmOS Le Marc says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: Should *not be able to if *UNprovoked

Sultan Githan says in Thieves' Cant with a Djelian accent: In my opinion, we have a full admin team, as well as an enforcer team. Once the enforcer team is final and public, there should be plenty of other avenues to go to if a thief steal from another. They should have the right to fight back if attacked however.

Sythyr says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: Anytime I've seen a PK thief steal from another, it's been unintentional and the PK thief whodunnit was young and a bit unawares of things. I found a talking-to set them right, and allowing Thieves to seek their own retribution in those cases is probably unneeded, and would confuse them even more on the general respect and killing rules.

Honest Greyko von Gypsy says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: In AM you could say, show the receipt to admin/enforcer and it'll be taken care of, outside, who's to say what's happened, very difficult.

Shifty Stickgod nods at Furtive FirAmOS Le Marc.

Flatline Debonaire asks in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: Isn't the guild rule something about treating fellow thieves with respect? Is stealing from someone really treating them with respect?

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: Well, of course, there are pros and cons to both options :)

Sultan Githan says in Thieves' Cant with a Djelian accent: After all, we have the resources to settle the situation in a much more final way than a single pk thief could :)

Elusive Simidhel von Helsing asks with a Morporkian accent: i think letting people enact their own vengeance could get out of hand?

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: The major pro towards a standard 'no killing' rule is simplicity.

Faye Fi Fo Fam asks with a Genuan accent: If a PK thief is stolen from by another thief, allowing them "retribution" would cause all sorts of havoc. Do they steal it back? Do they kill the other thief? Do they drag the corpse out into the terrain and loot it? Where do you draw the line?

Elusive Dirklurk spends a moment in thought with his head bowed.

Elusive Galadriel says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: Aye, blanket rule, covers all sorts of dodgers.

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: But the major con is, what do you do if someone is trying to steal something from you, run away, and log off never to be seen again...

Honest Greyko von Gypsy agrees with DantheMan Dominare wholeheartedly.

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: For example, what am I supposed to do if (say) someone filches my chocolate gauntlets.

Sythyr says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: Street justice just gets messy. I don't like it.

Shifty Stickgod sweats.

Faye Fi Fo Fam nods at Sythyr.

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: Those aint cheap or easy to replace - I might not have -time- to find an enforcer :)

Elusive Simidhel von Helsing says with a Morporkian accent: idea an enemy list again so you notice them ever log back on? :)

Furtive FirAmOS Le Marc says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: You should be allowed to kill or steal it back.

Honest Greyko von Gypsy says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: Best idea is to have the enforcers handle it, but you can't expect someone to stand by while someone repeatedly tries stealing either

Nyoink Quixonte eyes DantheMan's gauntlets.

Nyoink Quixonte whistles innocently.

Myndes Felin says with a Genuan accent: it is usually better to avoid exceptions in rules.

Elusive Dirklurk says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: The same issues arise if a PK thief steals from a PK non-thief.

Elusive Simidhel von Helsing grins lopsidedly at Nyoink Quixonte.

Mross gets off a bench and stands up.

Mross leaves down.

Evasive Akaishi asks in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: suppose someone steals my irreplacable hoobindaw bandersnatch 5000 and I want it back?

Chopper says in Thieves' cant: also, if someone steals from say 5 people and they all deal with it themselves then no-one knows he's a genuine arse, but if they all report him then the guild admin deal with him properly. Let the guild admin deal with it, that's partly what they're for..

DantheMan Dominare nodnods at Chopper.

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: Oh, I think it should -always- be reported.

Galadriel nodnods at Chopper.

Faye Fi Fo Fam says with a Genuan accent: I agree with Chopper.

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: No matter the eventual rule.

Dodgy Mohvati Casaubon says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: If you were to allow retribution, it's quite simple. Any act would be returned in a matter befitting the original act. If stolen from you steal, if killed, you kill, etc. It's not that difficult. But that get's complicated, and messy, especially if there's no solid proof of it.

Elusive Dirklurk agrees with DantheMan Dominare wholeheartedly.

Dodgy Mohvati Casaubon says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: It gets, too.

Honest Greyko von Gypsy says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: Admin is only useful if people come to us, if you don't talk to us about things, we're not going to know.

Sythyr says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: As I was mischatting, I don't see any problem with stealing it back in theory, it'd just be hard to prove in the cases outside of city walls with no receipts and stuff. You could end up stealing the wrong person's X.

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: Ooh, good one :p

Sultan Githan says in Thieves' Cant with a Djelian accent: I'm against vigilante retribution 100%. Take steps to defend yourself sure, but leave punishment to admin.

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: How about, then, that it is legal to steal from a fellow thief *IF* you are stealing an item they just stole from you :p

Faye Fi Fo Fam says with a Genuan accent: Thieves steal from eachother in a non offensive way, think about the last time you were grouped with one of your guildmates only to have them hand your underwear to you. If things like that provoked killings and lootings.. I dread to think.

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: and you have proof (ward, failed steal, etc)

Furtive FirAmOS Le Marc says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: Anyone who attacks or steals unprovoked from another thief should be reported, and the victim should be allowed to react in whatever way they see fit.

Sultan Githan says in Thieves' Cant with a Djelian accent: I like Dan's rule

Mentalist DemonWynd agrees with Sultan Githan wholeheartedly.

Sultan Githan says in Thieves' Cant with a Djelian accent: I'd have trouble punishing someone for stealing back their own item if they have proof

DantheMan Dominare nodnods at Sultan Githan.

Mimer says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: the "eye for an eye" principle would work without destroying the blanket rule i think. you avoid the killing issue

Elusive Galadriel says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: That sounds fair enough, and it's still simple.

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: That way, the killing rule is left simple :)

DantheMan Dominare nods at Mimer.

Mross arrives from below.

Mross sits on a bench.

Elusive Dirklurk says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: Githan, that could lead to a situation where the penalty for stealing from a fellow thief is less than that would be given by a non-thief victim.

Evasive Akaishi asks in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: what, aside from non-gittishness keeps the higher level thieves from grazing on the lower level ones?

Sultan Githan says in Thieves' Cant with a Djelian accent: I don't think the victim should be allowed to act however he or she sees fit, that will just get messy, and it's best dealt with by admin, after talking to both parties.

Sultan Githan says in Thieves' Cant with a Djelian accent: Well, there would be no penalty applied to someone stealing something back that was stolen from them in the first place...

Ogrot DeNightshade arrives from below.

Ogrot DeNightshade beeps happily.

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: I would assume the original rule-breaker would be punished either way.

Shifty Stickgod removes the hunter's pack so he can remove the durable Klatchian black denim trenchcoat with sharp metal studs.

Shifty Stickgod wears the hunter's pack.

Sultan Githan says in Thieves' Cant with a Djelian accent: Absolutely.

Elusive Dirklurk spends a moment in thought with his head bowed.

Elusive Simidhel von Helsing asks with a Morporkian accent: but outside of a-m you don't always know who stole it? what if you steal what you think is yours but turns out to be the wrong person with the same sort of item? or are we applying this to a-m only?

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: But this caveat would allow the victim to regain their item.

Evasive Akaishi asks in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: would I get my item back?

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: We're saying only if you have proof, Sim

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: No guesses :p

Elusive Simidhel von Helsing says with a Morporkian accent: fair enough

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: If you don't see them, tough shit :p

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: Excuse my Klatchian.

Elusive Simidhel von Helsing says with a Morporkian accent: okay, that i would agree with then :)

Elusive Galadriel grins.

Faye Fi Fo Fam asks with a Genuan accent: if you dont see them, should you still report your suspicions to admin?

Furtive FirAmOS Le Marc says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: You wouldn't to saying tough shit if it was someone stealing your items outside of AM dan...

Mimer asks in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: so basically leave the "no killing fellow thieves" intact and add "stealing only allowed to reclaim an item stolen from you"?

Elusive Galadriel says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: Dan's very eloquent take on the matter sums it up nicely. :P

Juan has been idle for too long; he vanishes in a puff of boredom.

Juan leaves the game.

Mentalist DemonWynd asks in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: would one have to report the steal to admin, before attempting to steal the item back?

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: I'd recommend thieves having Sotto Voce wards on their valued items, just like other PKs.

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: Just as an aside.

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: No question, then.

Elusive Dirklurk says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: Reporting suspicions is probably going to wind up with being a bit of a headache.

Elusive Simidhel von Helsing flashes his his crested customised armour.

Nyoink Quixonte nods.

Nyoink Quixonte says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: Get your stuff engraved.

Sultan Githan asks in Thieves' Cant with a Djelian accent: No need to report immediately, first priority is to get the item back. But remember, it only works if you see the steal anyway, otherwise, how are you going to know from whom to steal it back?

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: Right.

Elusive Dirklurk asks in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: Should we have compulsory reporting though?

Honest Greyko von Gypsy says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: it is, but if we have a lot of suspicions reported about the same person, it's something we'd be able to look into

DantheMan Dominare nodnods at Honest Greyko von Gypsy.

Sultan Githan says in Thieves' Cant with a Djelian accent: But by all means, everything along those lines should be reported, _especially_ if you're stealing from another thief in response.

Faye Fi Fo Fam says to Honest Greyko von Gypsy with a Genuan accent: thats what I meant.

Elusive Dirklurk says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: Well, strongly recommended reporting anyway.

Elusive Galadriel nodnods greyok.

Elusive Galadriel rolls her eyes.

Elusive Galadriel nodnods at Honest Greyko von Gypsy.

Dodgy Mohvati Casaubon agrees with Honest Greyko von Gypsy wholeheartedly.

Nyoink Quixonte asks in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: Maybe we should start theft files? You know, a history on reported thefts?

Sultan Githan says in Thieves' Cant with a Djelian accent: Reporting only takes a few minutes, and it helps admin sort things out. We have a way of keeping track of all this.

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: Thunder already has :)

DantheMan Dominare grins.

Elusive Simidhel von Helsing asks with a Morporkian accent: hmm, would it help to have a place you record all these reports that was searchable?

Sultan Githan says in Thieves' Cant with a Djelian accent: We already have the means to do so Nyoink.

Elusive Galadriel says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: Aye, and we can easily pass the information onto each other.

Sythyr says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: I don't think compulsory reporting is necessary, if the Thieves in question feel the issue has been resolved satisfactorily. But suspicions shouldn't be ignored, either.

Sythyr curses her slow fingers.

Nyoink Quixonte asks in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: Do you mean the receipts, Githan?

Sultan Githan says in Thieves' Cant with a Djelian accent: We have a secret club for admin, complete with a board, so reporting even suspicion to a member of admin (enforcers, monitors, GM, AGM) means we'll all see it, and it'll be saved.

Ms Creation Iniquitous stretches.

Nyoink Quixonte nods.

Nyoink Quixonte says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: Never knew :)

Sultan Githan asks in Thieves' Cant with a Djelian accent: A related issue that's come up is what happens when a thief is grouped with assist, and a pk groupmate attacks another thief, and the grouped thief is idle and drawn into combat. It's happened a number of times, and has the potential to be abused "I swear I was idle when I joined in killing that thief." Any thoughts?

Elusive Dirklurk spends a moment in thought with his head bowed.

Evasive Akaishi says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: not so secret NOW is it

Faye Fi Fo Fam says with a Genuan accent: so if I was a PK thief running around Djeli and suddenly noticed someone had filched my most valued chocolate gauntlets, I could say to a member of admin "My bestest gauntlets were filched in DJB, I saw )pkthief) peeking at me and looking generally shifty."

Elusive Galadriel says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: S'a covert guild. ;)

Sythyr says to Nyoink Quixonte in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: Like he said, it's (or was) secret! :þ

Sultan Githan nods at Faye Fi Fo Fam.

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: OK, one thing at a time maybe :p

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: So, the proposal is this: The no-killing of fellow thieves rule is to remain sacrosanct, but it will be permitted for a thief to attempt to regain their item by use of theft commands if they know without doubt that a fellow thief took it.

Sultan Githan nods at DantheMan Dominare.

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: Can we get some kind of vote maybe? :p

Faye Fi Fo Fam nods at Sultan Githan.

Mross says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: once is an accident, twice is maybe an accident, three times is enemy action.

Honest Greyko von Gypsy says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: Perhaps these are issues we can put to a vote, so people not here can vote on it

Sultan Githan says in Thieves' Cant with a Djelian accent: We have the voting feature that admin can call. We'll call any votes we feel appropriate after the meeting.

Lexx Rehevkor says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: A vote'd be a good idea..

Honest Greyko von Gypsy nods at Sultan Githan.

Sultan Githan nods at Honest Greyko von Gypsy.

Sultan Githan side fives Honest Greyko von Gypsy.

Honest Greyko von Gypsy grins.

Dodgy Mohvati Casaubon agrees wholeheartedly.

DantheMan Dominare asks in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: Well, is there anyone here who actually opposes the idea?

DantheMan Dominare looks around.

Elusive Galadriel says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: Aye, we'll take a vote on it - set it up after the meeting then.

Sythyr twiddles her thumbs.

Sultan Githan shuffles his feet in embarrassment.

Elusive Galadriel grins.

Elusive Simidhel von Helsing asks with a Morporkian accent: incidentally what hapapnes with failed attempts to steal the item back leading to combat and possible killing of another thief as a result?

Ogrot DeNightshade asks in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: Well, why wouldn't you take it up with admin instead of stealing it back?

Elusive Dirklurk shakes his head.

Elusive Simidhel von Helsing says with a Morporkian accent: happens*

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: It could only lead to combat if one thief attacks.

Honest Greyko von Gypsy says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: there could be issues with it, someone nicks your t-dags, and you nick the wrong ones back, that sorta thing, but there'll be problems with anything we come up with

Nyoink Quixonte nods.

Faye Fi Fo Fam asks Elusive Simidhel von Helsing with a Genuan accent: the thief who provoked the attack by stealing is surely the offender?

Elusive Dirklurk spends a moment in thought with his head bowed.

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: Which is a different breach of the rules, and possibly a harsher punishment.. :p

Elusive Simidhel von Helsing says with a Morporkian accent: okay, i don't know how pk works any more, i'll hush :)

Shifty Stickgod nodnods.

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: I know what Sim is asking - he's talking about a theft command starting combat w/fail

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: But that only happens with NPCs

Sythyr randomly says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: We're going to end up with a small charter, aren't we.

Faye Fi Fo Fam pats Elusive Simidhel von Helsing on the hand.

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: between PKs, you need a 'kill' or a

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: 'backstab' or whatever :p

Elusive Simidhel von Helsing says with a Morporkian accent: thanks :)

Sultan Githan says in Thieves' Cant with a Djelian accent: I'm opposed to attacking thieves, even in the event of failed steals. Report it to admin, avoid the thief, and if they continue to pursue and attempt steals, we'll deal with on a case by case basis.

Ogrot DeNightshade agrees with Sultan Githan wholeheartedly.

Faye Fi Fo Fam says to Sultan Githan with a Genuan accent: that sounds good.

Elusive Galadriel agrees with Sultan Githan wholeheartedly.

Mentalist DemonWynd says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: i agree

Mross nods at Sultan Githan.

Sultan Githan asks in Thieves' Cant with a Djelian accent: Any final thoughts?

Honest Greyko von Gypsy nods.

DantheMan Dominare shakes his head.

Lexx Rehevkor says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: My face hurts. :/

Shifty Stickgod shakes his head.

Sultan Githan touches Lexx Rehevkor face.

Elusive Galadriel peers at Lexx Rehevkor.

Sultan Githan mutters under his breath.

Sythyr looks over at Lexx Rehevkor.

Furtive FirAmOS Le Marc says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: I'm cold, totally unrelated. :)

Lexx Rehevkor shudders at Sultan Githan.

Elusive Dirklurk studies Lexx Rehevkor.

Sultan Githan asks in Thieves' Cant with a Djelian accent: Any thoughts on the group assist issue? Did people understand that?

Elusive Dirklurk says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: Tricky one.

Nyoink Quixonte says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: I understand it, but I don't know how it can be policed, or backed up.

Evasive Akaishi asks in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: quick summary please?

Honest Greyko von Gypsy says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: i think it's near impossible to have a set rule on that. no killing thieves, so they have to leave combat... if they special or whatever, then definite rule breaking

Mross says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: if it happens once, it could be an accident. if it happens more than once, it may not be.

Elusive Dirklurk spends a moment in thought with his head bowed.

DantheMan Dominare nodnods.

DantheMan Dominare asks in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: Yeah, restate it for the record?

Sultan Githan says in Thieves' Cant with a Djelian accent: Thief A is grouped, idle, and on assist with another PK. That PK attacks thief B, and thief A is drawn into fighting thief B.

Juan Navarro enters the game.

Nyoink Quixonte bows to Juan Navarro.

Shifty Stickgod scratches his head.

Faye Fi Fo Fam says to Sultan Githan with a Genuan accent: I think thieves killing thieves should be punished regardless of assisting. Its a case of being aware that your groupmates wont do anything to get you disavowed or punished in anyway.

Sultan Githan says in Thieves' Cant with a Djelian accent: Obviously if thief A isn't idle and doesn't take steps to avoid the combat, it's still killing another thief, but when thief A claims to be idle, it gets a bit grey.

DantheMan Dominare gives some other people a chance to speak for a bit ;)

Faye Fi Fo Fam doesn't know why she directed that at Githan, but meh...

Furtive FirAmOS Le Marc says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: I think the PK should warn thief A to unassist.

Evasive Akaishi asks in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: but what if the combat is a result of a failed steal on the groupmate?

Furtive FirAmOS Le Marc says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: On the other hand, if Thief b attacks the other PK, group assist is acceptable.

Sultan Githan asks in Thieves' Cant with a Djelian accent: I personally can't think of a great rule here, anyone have

Sultan Githan asks in Thieves' Cant with a Djelian accent: I personally can't think of a great rule here, anyone have

Mross asks in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: stop grouping with people who attack thieves?

Honest Greyko von Gypsy asks in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: i guess if a thief is going to idle, he could unassist?

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: Well, since you -ask- and all...

DantheMan Dominare coughs.

Elusive Galadriel grins at DantheMan Dominare.

Sultan Githan says in Thieves' Cant with a Djelian accent: That's a similar issue, people have joined in fights to defend non thief groupmates against thieves, which, IMO, is unacceptable.

Honest Greyko von Gypsy says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: But I see Faye's point, you choose your company, if you're in bad company, expect bad things.

Mimer asks in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: youre responsible for what you do in a group, if idle, unassist?

Chopper says in Thieves' cant: if it's out of the blue then A is at fault, if B did something to provoke the other guy then B is at fault, I reckon

Shifty Stickgod waits for brilliance

Sythyr says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: Perhaps (if possible, I don't know how fast PK combat happens) PK Thief under attack could finger/idle the PK thief to see if they really are idle.

Sultan Githan says in Thieves' Cant with a Djelian accent: It's certainly worth checking if any of you find yourself in that situation.

Sythyr says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: But that doesn't really prevent anything, and puts too much burden of proof on the victim.

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: It is usually pretty clear from logs whether someone on assist is actually AFK or not :p

Nyoink Quixonte says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: I'm not inclined to finger someone attacking me.

Evasive Akaishi says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: assuming there are logs

Nyoink Quixonte says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: Usually not enough time.

Lexx Rehevkor says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: I think this is too much of a complex issue to make any policy on.. I think it should just be handled on a case by case basis..

Juan Navarro asks in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: Which side of the logs though?

Elusive Dirklurk says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: If the burden of proof is on the alleged attacker, the logs could be forged to avoid punishment.

Ogrot DeNightshade says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: If there aren't logs, then there's no proof anyway

Sultan Githan says in Thieves' Cant with a Djelian accent: I may agree with Lexx.

DantheMan Dominare nodnods at Lexx Rehevkor.

Elusive Galadriel says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: Aye, I'm with Lexx.

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: Here's what I feel, at least in general principles...

Sultan Githan says in Thieves' Cant with a Djelian accent: But if there are logs disproving idlenss, it's a seperate issue, and the thief should be spoken with.

Elusive Galadriel says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: It becomes far too complicated.

Mross says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: one time should get a warning or low-level punishment. twice a harsher punishment, and the third time should be something akin to sanction.

Elusive Simidhel von Helsing briefly consults the Thieves' Guild Licence.

Shifty Stickgod nodnods at Lexx Rehevkor.

Nyoink Quixonte nods at mross.

Lexx Rehevkor says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: Wow, people are paying attention to me.. I'm so happy.

Sythyr grins at Lexx Rehevkor.

Mentalist DemonWynd pats Lexx Rehevkor on the back.

Honest Greyko von Gypsy says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: and logs can be hand written/edited, so that's not even total proof

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: If a thief is going to attack a group that has another fellow PK thief in, they have to be open to the risk that said grouped thief is going to be AFK and on assist...

Furtive FirAmOS Le Marc pats Lexx Rehevkor on the head.

Honest Greyko von Gypsy nods.

Evasive Akaishi nodnods at DantheMan Dominare.

Honest Greyko von Gypsy says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: there's responsibility on both parties

Sultan Githan says in Thieves' Cant with a Djelian accent: Yes, but any active assistance by that thief is still a breach of rules, imo.

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: However, I also think that if a group containing a PK thief on assist attacks a non-grouped thief..

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: Then we should hold the grouped thief responsible.

Sultan Githan says in Thieves' Cant with a Djelian accent: It's a complex issue, case by case may be the only option.

Honest Greyko von Gypsy says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: you're in a group with pks and afk, you can turn assist off. if you attack a group with a thief in it, expect they'll be assisting

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: Or at least, warn for a first offense..

Faye Fi Fo Fam says with a Genuan accent: Agree with Dan.

Honest Greyko von Gypsy nods at Sultan Githan.

Mross nodnods at at DantheMan Dominare.

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: In other words, if you assist your friend who is PK and he gets you into trouble by killing another thief when you're AFK...

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: ...then you should learn from that :p

Sultan Githan says in Thieves' Cant with a Djelian accent: I'd say if it becomes a repeat problem, even if it's with idleness, action should be taken.

Chopper agrees with DantheMan Dominare wholeheartedly.

Mross nodnods at at DantheMan Dominare.

Sultan Githan nods at DantheMan Dominare.

Shifty Stickgod nods at DantheMan Dominare.

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: if it happens more than once, its not so much of a coincidence anymore :p

Elusive Galadriel says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: Aye.

DantheMan Dominare nodnods.

Faye Fi Fo Fam says with a Genuan accent: Which will basically be a case of "They started it first!"

Elusive Dirklurk says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: A warning could be appropriate for a first offence, but it should be made clear that a second offence would involve the book being thrown.

Flatline Debonaire asks in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: How many cases are we talking about recently?

Mross says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: that's what i'm sayin'

Sultan Githan says in Thieves' Cant with a Djelian accent: Nothing recently, IMO, there were several issues under Carino though.

Elusive Simidhel von Helsing sits on a bench.

Shifty Stickgod idles like Pinkfish.

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: I do agree though that there are too many factors to create a concrete rule :p

Dodgy Mohvati Casaubon says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: I think verifying things by log is a bad idea. You can get into an entire range of issues with that, anything from false logs to people claiming a member of admin is friends with someone so gave them unfair treatment, etc. It seems it would be best to keep to a (mostly) clear cut and simple policy.

Elusive Dirklurk spends a moment in thought with his head bowed.

Furtive FirAmOS Le Marc mourns Shifty Stickgod.

Flatline Debonaire nodnods.

Elusive Simidhel von Helsing says with a Morporkian accent: concrete rules should always involve boots

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: A screenshot is a nice way :p

Sythyr grins at Elusive Simidhel von Helsing.

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: Harder to fake than a log

Honest Greyko von Gypsy asks in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: so, try to avoid it, but no definite rule?

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: but I digress :p

Sultan Githan says in Thieves' Cant with a Djelian accent: Well, logs aren't the be all and end all, but they help the decision making process.

Shifty Stickgod says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: a screenshot is a great idea

Juan Navarro asks in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: So if we agree no concrete rule can be made, is that it?

Sythyr grins mischeviously.

Sultan Githan agrees with Honest Greyko von Gypsy wholeheartedly.

Sythyr says to DantheMan Dominare in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: Don't get me started on that one again.

Sultan Githan says in Thieves' Cant with a Djelian accent: Screenshots are also available to people without logging ability.

Flatline Debonaire says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: A screenshot requires knowledge of photoshoot instead of notepad. :P

Honest Greyko von Gypsy opens up photoshop and creates an interesting screenshot

Mross says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: a simple guideline is to give a warning the first time, a punishment the second time, and sanction or kicked out of the guild the third time.

Elusive Dirklurk says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: I think that's where it's going to have to stay. No definite rule.

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: If we agree no concrete rule can be made... but that every PK thief should think before they assist... then fine :p

Honest Greyko von Gypsy nods.

Juan Navarro says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: Brb :p

Juan leaves the game.

Sythyr leers at Honest Greyko von Gypsy screenshot.

Elusive Galadriel says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: Yes.

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: I don't assist people I don't trust :p

Elusive Galadriel nodnods at DantheMan Dominare.

Vryl goes white, looks very chalky and turns into a statue.

Sultan Githan says in Thieves' Cant with a Djelian accent: I'd say there isn't too much more to be discussed on this issue.

Shifty Stickgod nodnods.

Elusive Dirklurk spends a moment in thought with his head bowed.

Sultan Githan listens carefully to Elusive Galadriel.

DantheMan Dominare nodnods at Sultan Githan.

Mross agrees with DantheMan Dominare wholeheartedly.

Elusive Galadriel exclaims in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: Right, next one up!

Furtive FirAmOS Le Marc nods.

Elusive Galadriel says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: Dan brought up the issue of git thieves, unruly thieves, and who should be dealing with them.

Mross asks in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: what defines an unruly or git thief?

Elusive Galadriel asks in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: ie Our Admin, the other guild's admin, or just general PK members?

Sultan Githan says in Thieves' Cant with a Djelian accent: Harassment alts for example. People who make thieves just to abuse filch.

Faye Fi Fo Fam says with a Genuan accent: what Mross said.

Faye Fi Fo Fam asks with a Genuan accent: what counts as abuse of filch?

Creation has been idle for too long; she vanishes in a puff of boredom.

Honest Greyko von Gypsy says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: well, what other people do is their own business, but general pk thieves shouldn't deal with the gits

Sythyr asks in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: I think the stuff we were talking about with street justice mostly applies here too. In most cases, aren't the administration equipped to do the most harm to the gits?

Sultan Githan says in Thieves' Cant with a Djelian accent: Making a character with 300 stealing, going pk at two days, and filching 100 times from someone then logging out or running to bro daves.

Mimer asks in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: more like killing other guilds instructors etc? for npk?

Sultan Githan says in Thieves' Cant with a Djelian accent: It's usually quite clear :p

Mross says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: okay, that's definite git behavior

Elusive Simidhel von Helsing asks with a Morporkian accent: i think if PK members approach the guild admin about it then a response would probably be appreciated by the community in general, making the guild seem more responsible overall?

Faye Fi Fo Fam says to Sultan Githan with a Genuan accent: if they log out, there's no way to punish the offending thief.

Sultan Githan says in Thieves' Cant with a Djelian accent: I have an important message from Irixgero, who couldn't make it.

Faye Fi Fo Fam says with a Genuan accent: and no one stays in David's forever.

Mross says to Faye Fi Fo Fam in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: they've got to log back in again eventually.

Sultan Githan says in Thieves' Cant with a Djelian accent: and I quote "All Muggers are fattsoes"

Sultan Githan says in Thieves' Cant with a Djelian accent: That is all.

Honest Greyko von Gypsy says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: if it's a harassment alt, they dont have to log back in at all

Nyoink Quixonte grins at Sultan Githan.

Lexx Rehevkor says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: I don't think defining git thieves is really the issue here, they're usually pretty obvious then they crop up...

Sultan Githan says in Thieves' Cant with a Djelian accent: Or Irixgero can make it.

Elusive Galadriel says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: It's as mentioned before - personally, I'd prefer to be made aware of situations such as this, even if no action is required.

Mross says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: oh, that's true. hadn't considered that.

Dodgy Igorken Pugionis exclaims in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: Woo, I'll have to tell Doss to give Irix some free beers!

Shifty Stickgod agrees wholeheartedly.

Faye Fi Fo Fam says to mross with a Genuan accent: not if they are just abuse alts. If they log back in, deal with it when they log back in. A thief, whatever the intention, has the filch command. If the way he uses it isn't breaking any of our rules, ie. Stealing from fellow thieves, I dont see how it is wrong.

Sultan Githan says in Thieves' Cant with a Djelian accent: Like, make sure the pk community knows that git thieves should be reported to admin, so we can at least keep an eye out, and step in if nothing else is working? After all, they reflect on all of us, so they're our problem, even if not our responsibility.

Mross says to Faye Fi Fo Fam in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: true.

Elusive Galadriel nodnods at Sultan Githan.

Sythyr agrees with Sultan Githan wholeheartedly.

Elusive Dirklurk says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: I don't think that we can really punish a git thief if he's not breaking guild rules.

Elusive Simidhel von Helsing agrees with Sultan Githan also.

Elroy arrives from below.

Lexx Rehevkor stares intently into space for a bit.

Nyoink Quixonte says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: No, but I think it's fair to say he/she might still need a talking to if reflecting badly on the guild.

Elusive Galadriel says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: " 2. Do not bring heat down onto the guild."

Honest Greyko von Gypsy says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: well, the rules are vague enough to cover that

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: I think good communication between guild leaders helps, too :)

Elusive Dirklurk says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: Mind you, that sort of behaviour could come under "bringing heat on the guild"

Faye Fi Fo Fam says with a Genuan accent: a talking to, perhaps.

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: present and future

Honest Greyko von Gypsy says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: basically, being a git IS breaking the rules

Elusive Dirklurk spends a moment in thought with his head bowed.

Irixgero Dominare sits on Sultan Githan's lap.

Sultan Githan says in Thieves' Cant with a Djelian accent: We don't have to support thieves who don't share our values... in the future it seems we'll have some ability to limit what they can get from the guild, without busting out the full old style sanction.

Mross says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: sometimes people don't realize they're being gits, so a talking-to may fix it. of course, if the behavior continues after that....

Nyoink Quixonte opens the close-fitting black leather bag.

Sultan Githan tips his hollowed-out-assassin-head-worn-as-a-hat at Irixgero Dominare stylishly.

Honest Greyko von Gypsy says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: Well, I think we're getting good communication between the admin, what we need are the other players communicating with us.

Nyoink Quixonte closes the close-fitting black leather bag.

Honest Greyko von Gypsy nods mrross.

Honest Greyko von Gypsy slaps his forehead and exclaims: D'oh!

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: I really meant between our guild admin and that of other guilds :p

Elusive Dirklurk asks in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: Perhaps there could be a sort of probation system?

Honest Greyko von Gypsy says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: ah

Honest Greyko von Gypsy grins.

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: For example, if we have to punish an MR then I think we should let the Don know... that way, if the Don has to sanction a thief for being a git, he/she reciprocates... and that's information that can be nice to have :p

Honest Greyko von Gypsy nods.

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: Generally a two-way street - in my experience, if you don't talk to them, they don't talk to you either :p

Sultan Githan says in Thieves' Cant with a Djelian accent: The assassins are really the only other guild with legit admin.

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: and having all the facts you can get is ideal

Honest Greyko von Gypsy says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: that's something we could set up

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: They are *now* yes

Elusive Dirklurk says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: That is, they could be put on notice that further complaints in a period of time would result in a sanction.

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: I remember Cold setting up a club for all the GMs and guild admin way back :p

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: Chamber, I think it was called

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: never took off, but it was a nice idea :p

Honest Greyko von Gypsy says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: sounds a good idea

Elusive Galadriel grins at DantheMan Dominare.

Honest Greyko von Gypsy scowls at Ronel.

Elusive Galadriel says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: Aye, I agree, it's a very good idea.

Sultan Githan says in Thieves' Cant with a Djelian accent: Especially if we can get a club with a board.

Elusive Galadriel says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: And anything to open things up and keep the communication going.

Irixgero Dominare stares intently into space for a bit.

Elusive Galadriel nodnods at Sultan Githan.

Fingers Rupert arrives from below.

Honest Greyko von Gypsy stares intently into space for a bit.

DantheMan Dominare stares intently into space for a bit.

Elusive Simidhel von Helsing reads Ronel.

Elusive Galadriel asks in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: Right, so did we reach a conclusion here?

Vryl has been idle for too long; he vanishes in a puff of boredom.

Sultan Githan says in Thieves' Cant with a Djelian accent: Perhaps the best course of action is to establish such a club.

Elusive Galadriel nodnods at Sultan Githan.

Elusive Galadriel says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: Will be right on it. ;)

Mentalist DemonWynd says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: i think so

Honest Greyko von Gypsy says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: that'll help with npks causing some troubles too

Elusive Galadriel says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: Sounds like the way to go.

Sultan Githan nods.

Shifty Stickgod agrees wholeheartedly.

Nyoink Quixonte asks in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: I'm wondering how we can inform everyone that such a new system will be in place, aside from a notice on frog?

Elusive Galadriel says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: One last big issue I'd like to bring up - another PK matter, in regards to a mediation service we might establish.

Sultan Githan says in Thieves' Cant with a Djelian accent: We can speak with the other admin individually, it's not a problem.

Elusive Galadriel says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: Speak to those involved :P

Sultan Githan says in Thieves' Cant with a Djelian accent: And I'd imagine we'll host this whole meeting somewhere.

Juan Navarro enters the game.

Mimer says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: set it up with guild admin, let them inform their respective guilds

Nyoink Quixonte says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: I mean, rather, other players.

Elusive Galadriel nods at Mimer.

Sythyr says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: I'm logging it, and plan to de-spamify and colour it.

Irixgero Dominare zips around Mimer.

Nyoink Quixonte says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: Oh, righto *grins foolishly*

Elusive Galadriel says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: Mediation service. Basically, it has occurred a couple of times in the last months with pk thievs offering to return items they have stolen, and gotten killed in the process.

Mimer meows at Irixgero Dominare.

Sultan Githan nods at Sythyr.

Elusive Dirklurk says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: Sounds quite reasonable.

Faye Fi Fo Fam says with a Genuan accent: want the ledger back...

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: This came up in the last meeting, I seem to remember :p

Evasive Akaishi says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: that sounds like business as usual to me, though I've never been in the situation myself

Nyoink Quixonte closes the medium sized amber bottle.

Nyoink Quixonte opens a pocket in the close-fitting black leather bag.

Nyoink Quixonte puts the medium sized amber bottle in a pocket in the close-fitting black leather bag.

Nyoink Quixonte closes a pocket in the close-fitting black leather bag.

Elusive Galadriel says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: The mediation service would provide a go between, for the victim of the theft and the thief in question - to the victim can receive the item back, the offending thief remains anonymous.

Dodgy Igorken Pugionis says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: Wasn't Sined selling Fruitcakes? Would be a nice spot for Insanity's corner.

Shifty Stickgod says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: i usually plant the item back on them

Nyoink Quixonte drops some Djelian ptascpi.

Sultan Githan says in Thieves' Cant with a Djelian accent: I think maybe a club could be established by some enterprising thieves to do this.

Nyoink Quixonte tidies up the place, clearing away some Djelian ptascpi.

Mentalist DemonWynd says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: it would have to be a non-PK mediation service then? to ensure the mediator isn't attacked

Elusive Galadriel says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: Aye, must be PK though.

Sultan Githan says in Thieves' Cant with a Djelian accent: There's no more Insanity for him to have a corner. It was a success for a long time in my shop though.

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: That might be NPK interaction

Mentalist DemonWynd says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: ah, ok

Sultan Githan says in Thieves' Cant with a Djelian accent: Yeah, it would have to be PK only.

Elusive Simidhel von Helsing asks in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: would it break npk/pk interaction rules to have an npk conduct the hand back?

Evasive Akaishi says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: would this service be open to anyone regardless of guild? I've seen wizards doing snatch-and-runs before

Elusive Dirklurk asks in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: Just a thought, does that mean that a mediated return of stolen goods would force the victim of the threat to seek no further action?

Honest Greyko von Gypsy says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: well, this is the problem, if it's a pk, the mediator could be killed/looted, if it's npk, it's interaction

Sythyr says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: But that would be... yeah. NPK interaction.

Irixgero Dominare asks in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: cant we use Githans shop to sell items back?

Elusive Galadriel says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: No, the mediators would have to be protected - they're offering a service to the victim, if that's abused then they'll have to deal with the consequences of their actions.

Sultan Githan says in Thieves' Cant with a Djelian accent: My shop will be on auction very soon, if it isn't already.

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: no, because of the klatchian nationalisation :p

Elusive Galadriel gets a silver labret, a pair of pearl earrings, a holy water-soaked whip, some Ankh-Morpork dollars and some Ankh-Morpork pence, a fluffy helmet, a violet amethyst friendship ring, a Philosophers' Society pin, a black satin garter, seven club badges, a vintage verge watch, a golden-green amber diadem, a claddagh ring, a diamond ring and a black orchid from Thieves' Guild chapter room.

Elusive Galadriel juggles around her stuff and fumbles a claddagh ring, a silver labret, five club badges, a holy water-soaked whip, a black satin garter, a vintage verge watch, a black orchid, a pair of pearl earrings and a golden-green amber diadem.

Elusive Galadriel says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: Sorry :P

Elusive Galadriel equips two club badges, a diamond ring, a Philosophers' Society pin, a violet amethyst friendship ring, a fluffy helmet, a no. 7 throwing knife and a no. 5 throwing knife.

Sultan Githan gets a holy water-soaked whip from Thieves' Guild chapter room.

Sultan Githan leers.

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: What we really need, is a guild-run player shop to handle this stuff :p

Juan Navarro boggles at Elusive Galadriel.

Nyoink Quixonte asks in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: So what we need is teams of at least two to enforce the transfer, perhaps?

Mentalist DemonWynd grins.

Elusive Galadriel forgot about the corpse.

Furtive FirAmOS Le Marc says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: So much for keep spam as minimal as possible. :D

Honest Greyko von Gypsy says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: well, snatch and run is very obvious who stole, there's no worry about staying anonymous

Elusive Galadriel gets six club badges, a golden-green amber diadem, a pair of pearl earrings, a black orchid, a vintage verge watch, a black satin garter, a silver labret, a claddagh ring, a leather gorget, a hardened leather breastplate, a medium sized jade coloured bottle, a short leather miniskirt, a black backpack, a black patent leather corset and a small black key from Thieves' Guild chapter room.

Elusive Galadriel equips a black backpack, a short leather miniskirt, six club badges, a hardened leather breastplate, a leather gorget, a claddagh ring, a silver labret, a black satin garter, a vintage verge watch, a black orchid, a pair of pearl earrings and a golden-green amber diadem.

Sultan Githan offers to sell the holy water-soaked whip to Elusive Galadriel for A$10000.

Elusive Galadriel gets a grubby old sack from Thieves' Guild chapter room.

Nyoink Quixonte grins at Sultan Githan.

Elusive Galadriel gets a large satchel from Thieves' Guild chapter room.

Elusive Galadriel bops Sultan Githan on the head.

Sythyr asks in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: Isn't there a commercial property in the basement next to the Lounge?

Sythyr wonders what's happening with that.

Fingers Rupert leaves down.

Juan Navarro nods at Sythyr.

Evasive Akaishi asks in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: the game room?

DantheMan Dominare smirks at Sultan Githan.

Sultan Githan says in Thieves' Cant with a Djelian accent: Good question.

Sultan Githan winks at DantheMan Dominare.

Dodgy Igorken Pugionis says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: Wouldn't be accessible for non-thieves anyway

Elusive Galadriel asks in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: Guild run player shop is enticing, but is it viable?

Mross asks in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: so how would you determine what npk's should be intermediaries?

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: I submitted a big fat idea rep about this ages ago

Sultan Githan says in Thieves' Cant with a Djelian accent: I'm not sure what the deal on that is, or if anyone knows :p

Juan Navarro asks in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: It would, it's in an accesible area isn't it?

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: Never found out if its being considered or not, since we don't have a guild coder right now :p

Sultan Githan says in Thieves' Cant with a Djelian accent: Basement is accesible.

Sythyr says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: Isn't it, though? There're no guard thieves on those doors.

Elusive Dirklurk says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: Perhaps the NPK/PK interaction rules could be relaxed to allow a group of NPKs to provide the mediation service.

Sultan Githan says in Thieves' Cant with a Djelian accent: Yeah, we need an active creator before much can happen.

Dodgy Mohvati Casaubon says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: It is accessible to non-thieves.

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: That's asking a bit much, dirklurk :p

Elusive Galadriel says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: I'm not sure I'm comfortable with NPKs dealing with it at all.

Nyoink Quixonte nods.

Sythyr says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: We'd definitely need something formal stated by a creator before anything could go forward with NPKs.

Sultan Githan says in Thieves' Cant with a Djelian accent: There are plenty of pk thieves anyway, and yeah, it's a risk that isn't worth taking.

Elusive Galadriel says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: Too much potential for abuse, nevermind the MUD rules.

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: All you need is to make sure the mediators are badass enough to handle themselves :p

Elusive Galadriel says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: Aye. Well, until a shop comes along - there was a suggestion of a club.

Irixgero Dominare fishes around in Sultan Githan's pockets for a big winer.

Mross says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: hmm.

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: perhaps with some kind of guild punishment for betraying trust in official mediation

Dodgy Igorken Pugionis arrives from below.

Juan Navarro says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: We have a whole team of active creators working for us, dontchaknow.

Sythyr asks in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: Would mediators be able to handle their own thefts too, for added fun and confusion?

Dodgy Igorken Pugionis sits down down.

Elusive Dirklurk says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: Ah yes. I forgot the possibility of abuse by the NPKs.

Sythyr asks in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: And what would happen if a non-Mediator claimed to be one?

Elusive Galadriel nodnods at DantheMan Dominare.

Sultan Githan says in Thieves' Cant with a Djelian accent: I'd personally prefer if it was entirely seperate from admin.

Faye Fi Fo Fam says with a Genuan accent: I have a suggestion.

Sultan Githan says in Thieves' Cant with a Djelian accent: Make the club not secret.

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: Just have a list posted

Dodgy Igorken Pugionis stands up.

Nyoink Quixonte asks in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: Badges?

Dodgy Igorken Pugionis sits down.

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: I could update the official site with a list of mediators :p

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: take me 5 mins :p

Elusive Spontiff DeNightshade arrives from below.

Elusive Spontiff DeNightshade sits on the stage.

Elusive Galadriel agrees with Sultan Githan wholeheartedly.

Elusive Spontiff DeNightshade waves.

Dodgy Mohvati Casaubon waves.

Elusive Galadriel says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: Sounds good.

Sultan Githan nods at Mr Scruffy.

Shifty Stickgod listens to to Faye Fi Fo Fam.

Dodgy Igorken Pugionis says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: And then when you need one, they're not online...

Mohvati leaves the game.

Ms Creation Iniquitous enters the game.

Elusive Galadriel whaps Ronel over the head.

Nyoink Quixonte grins at Dodgy Igorken Pugionis.

Honest Greyko von Gypsy says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: I agree with Githan, seperate from admin, but, with an admin in it, just so it's official, anyone can start a club and put anything in the description

Furtive FirAmOS Le Marc welcomes Ms Creation Iniquitous.

Faye Fi Fo Fam says with a Genuan accent: When I was a little girl, about 5 days or so, a PK wizard showed me his slip of paper. He said to me "Can you ask that person if they are willing to sell it back?" and I asked the person, they had anonymity and they did sell back. I just went to one place, picked it up, took it back, sold it, then took the money back.

Elusive Dirklurk smirks at Dodgy Igorken Pugionis.

Faye Fi Fo Fam says with a Genuan accent: simple enough at the time.

Sultan Githan nods at Mr Scruffy.

Sythyr asks in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: Would the mediators be a one-way or two-way street? Both the stealing Thiefs and those stolen from could expect to contact one for a hope of working something out?

Dodgy Igorken Pugionis says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: Gufdamn, Faye, your accent is terrible.

Juan Navarro says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: Two way would all depend on the thiefs intentions.

Juan Navarro says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: And all your accents are terrible :p

Elusive Dirklurk asks in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: The issue of trust arises though. What could either party have done if you took the money (or item) and ran?

Elusive Galadriel says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: Two way preferrably.

Sultan Githan says in Thieves' Cant with a Djelian accent: I think this is something best left up to whoever it is who takes the initiative to run it.

Mross exclaims in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: all your accents are belong to us!

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: Trust becomes less of an issue with officially appointed mediators.

Faye Fi Fo Fam says with a Genuan accent: options output accent=unadulterated

Irixgero Dominare asks in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: could the mediator steal the item back after they sold it?

Lexx Rehevkor leers at mross.

Nyoink Quixonte rolls his eyes at mross.

Elusive Simidhel von Helsing says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: hmm, most of these issues seem to be of pk orientation... think I'll head off...

Faye Fi Fo Fam says with a Genuan accent: there is the "offer" command which means nothing exchanges hands

Elusive Simidhel von Helsing waves.

Elusive Galadriel asks in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: Is there anyone here that would be willign to partake in the service?

Elusive Simidhel von Helsing gets off a bench and stands up.

Elusive Simidhel von Helsing leaves down.

Sultan Githan blinks.

Elusive Galadriel says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: And Irix, no. :P

Faye Fi Fo Fam raises her hand.

DantheMan Dominare shrugs.

Juan Navarro says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: i would.

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: Sure, I'd do it.

Irixgero Dominare sobs quietly.

Mross says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: yes, i would.

Irixgero Dominare raises her eyebrows.

Irixgero Dominare raises her hand.

Elusive Galadriel nodnods.

Nyoink Quixonte says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: I would, but I'm not yet capable of defending myself properly.

Elusive Dirklurk says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: I'd be willing to help, but then I'm a dirty stinking NPK.

Faye Fi Fo Fam asks with a Genuan accent: I would, but why do Mediators have to be PK?

Shifty Stickgod says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: im in

Sythyr says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: I would, but I'm NPK so I don't think that counts. :þ

Irixgero Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: i can...when im on that is..and if i dont have to move much :P

Crafty Clarabel DeNightshade says with a Morporkian accent: I would if NPK's could be involved :)

Elusive Galadriel says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: Settled then. I'll get started on a club for that as well.

Honest Greyko von Gypsy asks in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: so do mediators have enforcer protection if this happens?

Ms Creation Iniquitous asks in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: partake in what service?

Sultan Githan says in Thieves' Cant with a Djelian accent: Irixgero, would you like to take scruffy to be your fluffy spouse

Mross says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: i hadn't planned on going pk for a long while, tho, if that's an issue.

Sythyr says to Honest Greyko von Gypsy in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: I think they should.

Nyoink Quixonte says to Ms Creation Iniquitous in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: Mediation between PK thief and victim.

Irixgero Dominare nodnods at Sultan Githan.

Sultan Githan says in Thieves' Cant with a Djelian accent: I think mediators should develop their own protection.

Lexx Rehevkor says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: A good point Greyko..

Sultan Githan grins.

Elusive Dirklurk spends a moment in thought with his head bowed.

Sythyr says to Honest Greyko von Gypsy in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: They'd be on official business, goodwill ambassadors sort of, and messing with them is messing with the Guild as a whole.

Evasive Akaishi nodnods at Honest Greyko von Gypsy.

Faye Fi Fo Fam asks with a Genuan accent: remind me again why mediators have to be PK?

Shifty Stickgod agrees wholeheartedly.

Irixgero Dominare asks in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: who is the enforcers anyway?

Juan Navarro says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: NPK interaction.

Elusive Dirklurk says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: Provided they don't do anything they shouldn't while on Guild business...

Sultan Githan says in Thieves' Cant with a Djelian accent: Maybe this is something that should be put to a vote, whether or not it should be an independent club, or guild assisted.

Dodgy Igorken Pugionis says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: Because NPK-PK interaction rules

Lexx Rehevkor says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: Because of the NPK/PK interaction rules.

Elusive Galadriel says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: PK/NPK interaction rules.

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: because we're not sure if stealing something from a player and handing it off to an NPK is cheating, yah

Dodgy Igorken Pugionis says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: +of

Sythyr says to Faye Fi Fo Fam in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: One, NPK/PK interaction rules; Two, trust/abuse issues.

Juan Navarro says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: When PK's use NPK's in that way.

Faye Fi Fo Fam says with a Genuan accent: If I was just robbed of my item of value the last person I would have patience with would be a PK thief. I'd rather go to an NPK knowing that they wouldn't screw me over too.

Nyoink Quixonte nods.

Evasive Akaishi says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: if it's guild backed then they know the mediator isn't going to mess them

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: Well, the theory is that a guild mediator would be trusted not to screw you over :p

Mross says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: npk's and pk's can do business already, so i'm not sure i understand the problem.

DantheMan Dominare comforts mross.

Mimer says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: therein the interaction that could be iffy, using an npk to avoid pk interaction in a pk matter

Elusive Galadriel says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: Problem is with NPKs is if they do screw you over, you can't do anything about it.

Faye Fi Fo Fam says to DantheMan Dominare with a Genuan accent: there are enough older, reliable, trustworthy, non-playerkilling thieves.

Irixgero Dominare points at Mimer.

Mross says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: sure you can, you report it to the admin and the git mediator gets heavied.

Faye Fi Fo Fam nods.

Mross says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: and booted as a mediator.

Elusive Dirklurk says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: There could be sanctions if a mediator did decide to do that.

Flatline Debonaire sulks in the corner.

Juan Navarro says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: As wrong as it sounds, I do believe non-thieves should still have the option to items back by force.

Irixgero Dominare points at Flatline Debonaire.

Juan Navarro says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: And this idea would undermine that ability.

Flatline Debonaire grins at Irixgero Dominare.

Irixgero Dominare points at herself.

Honest Greyko von Gypsy says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: well, i imagine the mediators are more in the case of a clean steal

Mross says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: not really, it provides them with a nonviolent path if they choose to use it.

Juan Navarro says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: The PK requirement would still leave that open, but in a very intimidating way. Which I believe would be better.

Faye Fi Fo Fam says with a Genuan accent: it doesn't remove the ability, it just offers another option to people who can't fight for themselves.

Honest Greyko von Gypsy says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: yeah, if you know who stole from you, whack 'em and take it back

Sultan Githan says in Thieves' Cant with a Djelian accent: That's why I support a seperate club. The service is still there, but it doesn't tie anyone's hands.

Nyoink Quixonte says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: This option is non-compulsory.

Chopper says in Thieves' cant: it wouldn't necessarily Juan, it'd just offer another option..

Elusive Galadriel says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: Right, well this is obviously going to take us around in circles. I suspect we'll have to put up a couple of polls on this one.

Elusive Dirklurk spends a moment in thought with his head bowed.

Juan Navarro says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: But you hand the item over to a mediator straight away, and you know it's safe.

Ms Creation Iniquitous stretches.

Juan Navarro says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: Clean steal or none, they wont get the item back.

Juan Navarro says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: Which I don't agree with.

Mr Scruffy nodnods at Sultan Githan.

Faye Fi Fo Fam says with a Genuan accent: not if the mediator is PK, they could be robbed of it.

Nyoink Quixonte says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: But the victim needs to know who you handed the item to.

Sythyr says to Juan Navarro in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: Yes, but any PK thief could pass off to any NPK accomplice and the same thing would happen.

Mross says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: just because a thief sends a mediator does not mean the other party *has* to deal with the mediator.

Juan Navarro says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: Which is a risk you take in trusting someone, so you don't have to do the selling yourself.

Faye Fi Fo Fam blinks hurukan.

Irixgero Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: isnt is possible to code something? you set up a shop..where the thief deposit the items...then the PK comes there buy the item..then the thief goes back and collect their money..a little fee for the shop and guild...

Faye Fi Fo Fam whaps herself over the head.

Elusive Galadriel asks in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: Are there any other issues anyone else would like to take up?

Irixgero Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: like "deposit sword for githan"

Juan Navarro says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: I like the idea. I just don't think NPK's are a good way to go about it.

DantheMan Dominare says to Irixgero Dominare in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: I idea'd something like that ages ago :p

Elusive Spontiff DeNightshade likes Irixgero's idea a lot.

Sythyr asks Irixgero Dominare in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: Like the Weapons Confiscation system in Bes Pelargic?

Irixgero Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: and githan would come and buy sword from shop

Elusive Dirklurk says to Irixgero Dominare in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: That sounds like how the confiscated items shop in BP works.

Sythyr exclaims in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: I kind of like that!

Elusive Spontiff DeNightshade says to Sythyr in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: exactly

Shifty Stickgod says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: i like that idea

Mross says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: but then you'd need such a shop in pretty much all cities.

Sythyr says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: And they'd possibly get a mudmail and everything.

Elusive Dirklurk says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: If it was a shop, the need for PCs is completely removed.

Mimer says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: coding stuff isnt really something the playerrun guild can control as such though

DantheMan Dominare nodnods at Mimer.

Elusive Galadriel agrees with Mimer wholeheartedly.

Elusive Dirklurk says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: PC mediators that is.

Elusive Galadriel says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: As good an idea it is, it's not something that can be implemented straight off.

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: Oh, I do have one :p

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: real quick question

Elusive Galadriel says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: Go ahead.

Juan Navarro says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: Devils advocate again, but once the item is in the shop, the victim can't get it back without paying. It's open to major abuse.

Elusive Spontiff DeNightshade says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: we can always idea rep it and if we're not happy with what the cres offer us, set up our own system

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: Disavowal - permanent, or not :p

Irixgero Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: once a thief deposit the item..the player gets a mail...your sword has been deposited in our shop,,,come on buy ot for zillion dollars (price set by thief)

Faye Fi Fo Fam says with a Genuan accent: non permanent.

DantheMan Dominare says to Irixgero Dominare in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: yes yes, its already been discussed :p

DantheMan Dominare grins at Irixgero Dominare.

Nyoink Quixonte says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: The price should be quota based.

Nyoink Quixonte says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: Plus a little extra for the thief and guild costs.

Juan Navarro says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: Hanf on, can we finish one topic first? :p

Elusive Spontiff DeNightshade asks Juan Navarro in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: but surely it's better than never seeing the item again?

Mentalist has been idle for too long; he vanishes in a puff of boredom.

Elusive Galadriel says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: We could talk about this one for 4 more hours and still get nowhere. I'm suggesting we move on and hold a vote on the mediator agenda.

Elusive Spontiff DeNightshade agrees with Nyoink Quixonte wholeheartedly.

Mentalist DemonWynd enters the game.

Evasive Akaishi asks in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: as opposed to finding the thief and taking it back for free?

Shifty Stickgod agrees wholeheartedly.

Juan Navarro says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: Ok, so long as we know a topic is finished ;)

Irixgero Dominare sobs quietly.

Mross nodnods at Elusive Galadriel.

Faye Fi Fo Fam asks with a Genuan accent: what if a theft victim wants to buy item back but thief hasnt considered selling it yet?

Elusive Dirklurk agrees with Elusive Galadriel wholeheartedly.

DantheMan Dominare nodnods.

Shifty Stickgod nodnods.

Elusive Dirklurk spends a moment in thought with his head bowed.

Faye Fi Fo Fam shrugs.

Elusive Galadriel asks in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: So, disavowal, permanent or temporary?

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: I say permanent :p as I always have.

Dodgy Igorken Pugionis says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: case by case

Irixgero Dominare whispers to Sultan Githan.

Elusive Spontiff DeNightshade says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: case by case

Sythyr says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: Non-permanent. Trilogy was just saying the other day she gets sanction and disavowal confused. And there's always the hypothetical abuse/misunderstanding clause.

Juan Navarro asks in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: Depends on the crime. Could always be used as a warning?

Sythyr asks in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: Are we talking hard-coded or no here?

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: I don't think disavowing someone should be a 'short holiday' :p

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: absolutely not

Mimer says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: considering the offences that should be needed for disavowal, permanent

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: warnings are sanctions, killings, etc

Furtive FirAmOS Le Marc says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: Permanent. If they do something so bad that warrants disavowel it should stick.

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: disavowal should be the end of the line

Nyoink Quixonte asks in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: What happens, exactly, when someone is disavowed?

Elusive Galadriel says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: I'd like to say that presumably permanent, but I can't say for sure. Case by case, personally. To be honest, if it's come to the fact that they need disavowal in the first polace, I'm thinking permanent.

Elusive Dirklurk agrees with DantheMan Dominare wholeheartedly.

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: Past GMs have reversed disavowals, and it makes me livid

Irixgero Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: id say guild master to guild master...if one disavow you..you cant get in before a new GM lets you in

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: if you kick someone out, they're out

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: imo

Furtive FirAmOS Le Marc agrees with DantheMan Dominare wholeheartedly.

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: otherwise, all you do is give them a short break from the rules

Mimer asks in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: do disavowals need seconding atm?

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: and that is no fucking use at all :p

Furtive FirAmOS Le Marc grins at DantheMan Dominare.

DantheMan Dominare twitches.

Elusive Galadriel says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: Aye. Considering we'll have a nice amount of alternatives now, that probably won't be difficult to keep.

Shifty Stickgod says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: brb

Juan Navarro says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: oh gods yeah. Once disavowel is used, it'll need balancing.

Elusive Galadriel says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: Not that I know of.

Elusive Galadriel grins at DantheMan Dominare.

DantheMan Dominare feels pretty strongly about this

Elusive Galadriel soothes DantheMan Dominare.

Faye Fi Fo Fam says to DantheMan Dominare with a Genuan accent: calm your tongue, if not your temper.

DantheMan Dominare wonders if anyone notices

Nyoink Quixonte smiles wryly.

DantheMan Dominare says to Faye Fi Fo Fam in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: It makes me so mad :p

Sultan Githan says in Thieves' Cant with a Djelian accent: I got reavowed :p

Irixgero Dominare grins at DantheMan Dominare.

DantheMan Dominare stares intently into space for a bit.

Nyoink Quixonte peers at Sultan Githan.

Elusive Galadriel grins at Sultan Githan.

Elusive Dirklurk notice Dantheman

Sultan Githan stares intently into space for a bit.

Furtive FirAmOS Le Marc asks Sultan Githan in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: You got disavowed, what for?

Faye Fi Fo Fam says to DantheMan Dominare with a Genuan accent: Even so. Expletives aren't needed to communicate that.

Sultan Githan says in Thieves' Cant with a Djelian accent: I joke.

Juan Navarro and Irixgero Dominare stare intently into space for a bit.

Sultan Githan says in Thieves' Cant with a Djelian accent: A joke.

Sythyr says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: Being the love child of some people or other, as I recall.

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: yes yes, I'm a bad boy :p

DantheMan Dominare spanks himself.

Elusive Galadriel leers at DantheMan Dominare.

Elusive Dirklurk spends a moment in thought with his head bowed.

Elusive Galadriel says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: Anyway, we digress.

Faye Fi Fo Fam says with a Genuan accent: how come Sonny was reavowed? I know why he was disavowed. I dont know of any other people that have been disavowed and reavowed.

Sultan Githan points at himself.

Elusive Galadriel stares intently into space for a bit.

Irixgero Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: sassins do it all the time

Faye Fi Fo Fam says with a Genuan accent: we're not Assassins though.

Elusive Dirklurk says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: We're not the assassins though.

DantheMan Dominare stares intently into space for a bit.

Mross says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: what faye said

DantheMan Dominare stares intently into space for a bit.

Mross says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: and dirklurk

Irixgero Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: we're not? damn wrong meeting:(

Elusive Galadriel says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: Aye well.

Furtive FirAmOS Le Marc grins at mross.

Elusive Dirklurk spends a moment in thought with his head bowed.

Nyoink Quixonte opens the close-fitting black leather bag.

DantheMan Dominare stares intently into space for a bit.

Elusive Galadriel says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: Either way, as much as whatever is said about the disavowal, Githan raised the point that the next GM may reavow anyway. :P

Nyoink Quixonte closes the close-fitting black leather bag.

DantheMan Dominare stares intently into space for a bit.

Elusive Galadriel stares intently into space for a bit.

DantheMan Dominare stares intently into space for a bit.

Shifty Stickgod stares into space.

Elusive Galadriel stares intently into space for a bit.

DantheMan Dominare stares intently into space for a bit.

Mimer asks in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: so basically you need a codechange to make disavowal permanent?

Honest Greyko von Gypsy stares intently into space for a bit.

Shifty Stickgod stares into space.

Elusive Galadriel stares intently into space for a bit.

Juan Navarro stares intently into space for a bit.

Faye Fi Fo Fam says with a Genuan accent: Disavow could be used in a non-permanent way as punishment, depriving a thief of his valued commands, backstab and filch, for an indetermined time.

Nyoink Quixonte asks in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: How many admin does it take to reavow at present?

Ogrot DeNightshade asks in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: Why do we need to make it permanent?

Elusive Galadriel stares intently into space for a bit.

Elusive Dirklurk stares into space.

Juan Navarro stares intently into space for a bit.

Chopper says in Thieves' cant: why do I get the impression that half of this debate is going on somewhere else...

Elusive Galadriel grins.

Irixgero Dominare stares intently into space for a bit.

Elusive Galadriel says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: Right well.

Juan Navarro says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: I agree on permanent.

Elusive Galadriel asks in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: Anymore questions?

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: sorry, we're actually talking about the thrown knife :p

Elusive Dirklurk spends a moment in thought with his head bowed.

Furtive FirAmOS Le Marc says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: Me too, permanent.

Mross says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: well, as long as their heads don't explode

Shifty Stickgod says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: bye thieves

Stickgod leaves the game.

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: It has to be permanent - or they can just go around killing and stealing from thieves all day every day, and then get allowed back into the guild later on :p

Elusive Dirklurk agrees with DantheMan Dominare wholeheartedly.

Faye Fi Fo Fam says with a Genuan accent: I dont agree it should be made permanent. There's the possibility of unfair judgement, favoritism, and temper tantrums.

DantheMan Dominare exclaims in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: which isn't a punishment at all!

Elusive Spontiff DeNightshade gets down on his knees and spends a short time in silence.

Juan Navarro says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: if they did that, do you think they'd get let back in? :p

Elusive Galadriel says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: Well, as Githan said. We can all say permanent until we're blue in the faces, but eventually someone may come along with a different view and reavow away. Personally, I'm all for permanent.

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: its already happened, juan :p

Sythyr says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: As much as I agree with DantheMan's view for gits, I also agree out of some paranoid fear with Faye's view. :/

Elusive Dirklurk says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: You have an appeal process if necessary.

Mross says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: if the gm, agm, and subspecialty monitor agree on disavowal, it should be permanent.

Irixgero Dominare asks in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: hmmm but its kinda scary making it permanent...what if i get shit drunk one night and kill githan over and over?

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: OK

Juan Navarro says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: Then whoever did the reavowel needs their head looking at.

Furtive FirAmOS Le Marc says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: I have to agree with everything Dantheman says on this topis, it's rediculous someone can do something warranting disavowing and get let back in.

Elusive Dirklurk says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: Insert "could" into my previous sentence.

DantheMan Dominare asks in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: how about if it needs a guild-wide vote?

DantheMan Dominare asks in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: to reavow?

Nyoink Quixonte says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: Then you shouldn't mud drunk ;)

Faye Fi Fo Fam says with a Genuan accent: It can be said that disavow is a permanent thing, thats fine by me. But in no way in hell should reavow be removed. Ever.

Juan Navarro says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: A guild wide vote once again becomes a popularity vote

Juan Navarro says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: And all based on what friends said to friends

Nyoink Quixonte says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: And not just that, newer players might not get the whole story.

Elusive Galadriel nodnods at Juan Navarro.

Sythyr says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: A guild-wide vote opens it up to popular opinion, which isn't always right or well-informed.

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: yeah true enough :p so better it needs the unanimous agreement of GM, AGM and all monitors? :p

Mimer says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: enough with an adminwide vote, only possible to instigate by the gm

Nyoink Quixonte says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: So it wouldn't be a balanced kind of vote.

Elusive Dirklurk says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: A vote could be done amongst the elected officials.

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: agreed, I retract the guild-wide vote idea :p

Juan Navarro says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: I know I trust my monitor enough to have voted for him.

Faye Fi Fo Fam says with a Genuan accent: I think that when reavowing, just a few things should be taken into consideration: firstly why they got reavowed, and their behaviour and attitude towards the guild and it's rules since.

Sythyr says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: That sounds better.

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: didn't think it through :p

Faye Fi Fo Fam says with a Genuan accent: firstly why they got disavowed, sorry. Mistype.

Elusive Dirklurk spends a moment in thought with his head bowed.

Nyoink Quixonte says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: I think a second disavowal should be permanent though.

Juan Navarro says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: Agreed.

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: Well, I don't think I have anything else to bring up...

Mross says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: i think just three people need to agree for the disavowal to be permanent: the gm, agm, and the specific subspecialty's monitor.

Elusive Spontiff DeNightshade gets down on his knees and spends a short time in silence.

Sultan Githan says in Thieves' Cant with a Djelian accent: I think both disavowal and reavowal should be at GM discretion, and if admin disgrees, we can always VoNC

Sythyr agrees with Nyoink Quixonte wholeheartedly.

Sultan Githan asks in Thieves' Cant with a Djelian accent: How do people feel about petitioning for a hardcoded Head Enforcer position?

Faye Fi Fo Fam says with a Genuan accent: What Mross suggested seems agreeable.

Juan Navarro says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: I wouldn't want to decide a vonc based on one decision.

Elusive Dirklurk agrees with mross wholeheartedly.

Mr Scruffy agrees with Sultan Githan wholeheartedly.

Faye Fi Fo Fam blows a raspberry at Sultan Githan.

Sythyr agrees with Juan Navarro wholeheartedly.

Nyoink Quixonte nodnods.

Sultan Githan oozes all over Faye Fi Fo Fam.

Flatline Debonaire agrees with Juan Navarro wholeheartedly.

Irixgero Dominare asks in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: reavowal could be used with AGMs consent?

Mross asks in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: we don't have a head enforcer already?

Faye Fi Fo Fam says to Irixgero Dominare with a Genuan accent: if the same goes for disavowal.

Elusive Galadriel says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: Not hard coded.

Elusive Dirklurk spends a moment in thought with his head bowed.

Juan Navarro asks in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: What would hard coded entail?

Faye Fi Fo Fam asks with a Genuan accent: what do you want coded, though, just the title and name on a plaque?

Sultan Githan says in Thieves' Cant with a Djelian accent: The fact of the matter is that none of these contraints are hardcoded, so it's basically all in the GM's hands now, and if people disagree, there are options to be taken.

Sythyr asks in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: What advantages would a hardcoded Head Enforcer position give over what we have now?

Sultan Githan asks in Thieves' Cant with a Djelian accent: A title, maybe an office?

Faye Fi Fo Fam raises one eyebrow.

Faye Fi Fo Fam asks with a Genuan accent: what for?

Elusive Galadriel says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: Apart from a shiny plaque in the entrance? :P

Sultan Githan says in Thieves' Cant with a Djelian accent: And powers equal to a monitor I guess... VoNC, the new sanction stuff if it ever happens, calling votes.

Honest Greyko von Gypsy asks in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: the use of the sanction commands when they come back?

Mr Scruffy says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: he can have his office in the Temporary Sign, tailor made for it

Sultan Githan grins at Mr Scruffy.

Juan Navarro asks in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: I thought sanction commands would stay as GM stuff?

Sultan Githan exclaims in Thieves' Cant with a Djelian accent: Oi, scruffy stole Galadriel's whip! Disavow!

Elusive Galadriel grins.

Nyoink Quixonte ponders.

Dodgy Igorken Pugionis says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: The Temporary Sign is MY office

Nyoink Quixonte asks Sultan Githan in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: I wonder how he got that?

Nyoink Quixonte grins at Sultan Githan.

Elusive Dirklurk spends a moment in thought with his head bowed.

Sultan Githan whistles innocently.

Elusive Spontiff DeNightshade gets down on his knees and spends a short time in silence.

Mimer asks in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: we have a big enough admin team for the sanction command already dont we?

Juan Navarro says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: No offence Dan, but HE isn't there for his diplomatic skills :p

DantheMan Dominare asks in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: eh?

Mr Scruffy gives a holy water-soaked whip to Elusive Galadriel.

Dodgy Igorken Pugionis exclaims in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: give sanction to all thieves, Mimer!

Elusive Galadriel gives Mr Scruffy a big wet smooch on the lips.

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: Githan's the current head enforcer, not me :p

Elusive Galadriel says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: I was waiting for him to use it first. :(

Mross says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: no thanks, i don't want it.

Sultan Githan says in Thieves' Cant with a Djelian accent: I just think it'd be a nice thing to have, and would raise the HE above "bloodthirsty hired goon"

DantheMan Dominare grins at Juan Navarro.

Juan Navarro says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: Sanctioning and disavowel shouldn't all go through the GM

Juan Navarro says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: Errr

Juan Navarro says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: Should

Sultan Githan says in Thieves' Cant with a Djelian accent: That's in Trilogy's hands...

Faye Fi Fo Fam asks with a Genuan accent: We have a big enough admin team to control the sanction command. Do they have a sanction command to control?

Irixgero Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: muhhahha Githan as head enforcer...hahahah

Irixgero Dominare points at Sultan Githan.

Irixgero Dominare laughs at Sultan Githan.

Nyoink Quixonte eeks.

Chopper says in Thieves' cant: dunno about commands and offices and such, but a with a title he's undeniably a guild official and without it he's just a jumped-up thug to some people

Sultan Githan stares at Irixgero Dominare.

Sultan Githan bites Irixgero Dominare.

Githan nods at Chopper.

Elusive Dirklurk spends a moment in thought with his head bowed.

Ms Creation Iniquitous yawns.

Irixgero Dominare accuses Sultan Githan of beeing a wimp.

Sultan Githan says in Thieves' Cant with a Djelian accent: I'd be happy with just a title.

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: that's true enough :p

Sythyr nodnods at Chopper.

Faye Fi Fo Fam gets a title changer from a pocket in a black backpack.

Faye Fi Fo Fam gives a title changer to Sultan Githan.

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: some kind of 'summon heavies' ability in AM would be excellent :p

Ms Creation Iniquitous stretches.

DantheMan Dominare snickers.

Faye Fi Fo Fam says to Sultan Githan with a Genuan accent: knock yourself out.

Sultan Githan whines at Faye Fi Fo Fam.

Juan Navarro says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: A title, and his own backroom in a pub would be good. ;)

Elusive Galadriel grins at DantheMan Dominare.

Juan Navarro blinks at Ronel.

Nyoink Quixonte exclaims in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: Alias summon_heavies t juan,Irixgero,dantheman Hoi! Get over here!

Juan Navarro asks in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: Heavying will stay as an AM only thing, yeah?

Nyoink Quixonte coughs.

Juan Navarro grins at Nyoink Quixonte.

Elusive Dirklurk spends a moment in thought with his head bowed.

Ms Creation Iniquitous whispers to Elusive Spontiff DeNightshade.

Sultan Githan gives a title changer to DantheMan Dominare.

Juan Navarro says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: It's all gone quiet.

DantheMan Dominare snickers at Sultan Githan.

Faye Fi Fo Fam say to Sultan Githan and DantheMan Dominare with a Genuan accent: I want that back later.

Elusive Galadriel says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: WEll.

DantheMan Dominare grins at Faye Fi Fo Fam.

Evasive Akaishi exclaims in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: ... TOO quiet!

Elusive Galadriel says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: I have an announcement to make.

Sythyr exclaims to Elusive Galadriel in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: Water, it's a deep subject!

Elusive Dirklurk exclaims in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: Shh!

Nyoink Quixonte sighs.

Nyoink Quixonte shakes his head at Sythyr.

Lexx Rehevkor asks in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: You're really a man?

Elusive Galadriel says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: Dantheman's agreed to take over as HE.

Furtive FirAmOS Le Marc listens carefully to Elusive Galadriel.

Nyoink Quixonte grins at Sythyr.

Sythyr beams at Nyoink Quixonte.

Sultan Githan congratulates DantheMan Dominare.

Honest Greyko von Gypsy grins at Sythyr.

Nyoink Quixonte woos at DantheMan Dominare.

Mross blinks.

Elusive Dirklurk congratulates DantheMan Dominare.

Furtive FirAmOS Le Marc cheers enthusiastically at DantheMan Dominare.

Faye Fi Fo Fam says with a Genuan accent: Hurrah.

Ms Creation Iniquitous wuffles DantheMan Dominare affectionately.

Evasive Akaishi applauds wholeheartedly.

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: As of about 2 mins ago :)

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: ta :)

The crowd goes wild.

Elusive Galadriel says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: And that said, if there are no more comments or questions...that's a wrap.

Furtive FirAmOS Le Marc laughs.

Mimer mimes two hands clapping.

Mr Scruffy thanks DantheMan Dominare.

Juan Navarro cheers enthusiastically at DantheMan Dominare.

Sultan Githan says in Thieves' Cant with a Djelian accent: We'll post a detailed post explaining the enforcer system and who the enforcers are before too long.

Elusive Galadriel grins at Mimer.

Elusive Dirklurk says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: Ah. All that staring had a point then.

Juan Navarro says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: So will heavying stay an AM thing? :p

Evasive Akaishi exclaims in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: Gimme cash prizes!

Sultan Githan says in Thieves' Cant with a Djelian accent: And we'll begin the appropriate polls.

Sythyr asks in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: Before we go, which issues are being put to votes, again?

Mimer asks in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: heavying as in the npcs?

Elusive Dirklurk congratulates Elusive Galadriel.

Nyoink Quixonte grins.

Juan Navarro says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: yeah

Elusive Dirklurk says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: Successful meeting. Two fa.po TMs.

Mimer says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: thats code again, and i doubt itll ever go outside AM

Juan Navarro says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: Are there plans to at least put them in our guild buildings across the disc

Elusive Dirklurk spends a moment in thought with his head bowed.

DantheMan Dominare fiddles with the title changer.

Juan Navarro asks in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: For NPC protection at the very least?

Elusive Spontiff DeNightshade gets down on his knees and spends a short time in silence.

DantheMan Dominare gives a title changer to Faye Fi Fo Fam.

DantheMan Dominare thanks Faye Fi Fo Fam.

Honest Greyko von Gypsy asks in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: also before we go, is there anything admin don't do the rest of thieves would like us to do? or do that you dont want us doing?

Faye Fi Fo Fam smiles at DantheMan Dominare.

Elusive Spontiff DeNightshade envies Elusive Dirklurk.

Ms Creation Iniquitous asks in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: so is that the meeting over?

Honest Greyko von Gypsy cheers enthusiastically at Elusive Dirklurk.

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: sing :)

Faye Fi Fo Fam says to DantheMan Dominare with a Genuan accent: it suits you.

Juan Navarro shrugs.

Flatline Debonaire coughs.

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: To celebrate the end of the meeting, I should like to sing a song :)

Elusive Dirklurk bows all.

Elusive Galadriel says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: I think Flatline would like some 'special treatment'.

Honest Greyko von Gypsy encourages DantheMan Dominare.

Irixgero Dominare comforts Flatline Debonaire.

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: ...once logging is disabled :p

Lexx Rehevkor eeks.

Juan Navarro walks off all ignored.

Elusive Galadriel says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: Uh oh.

DantheMan Dominare grins at Juan Navarro.

Elusive Dirklurk bows to all.

Nyoink Quixonte asks Sythyr in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: 1) The issue of mediation reagrding the return of items to PK theft victims. 2) Disavowal, permanent or no. 3) Head Enforcer. Did I miss anything?

Elusive Dirklurk leaves down.

Irixgero Dominare exclaims in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: RUN FOR THE HILLS!

Sultan Githan laughs.

Evasive Akaishi asks in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: The wheels on the guild go 'round and round?

Ms Creation Iniquitous waves all.

Faye Fi Fo Fam sings "Run for her lives!".

Ms Creation Iniquitous leaves down.

Nyoink Quixonte says to Sythyr in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: Oh and 4) Heavying.

Mimer says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: addendum to rule abt thieves stealing from thieves

Elusive Spontiff DeNightshade says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: could youput a little note on the board about once a month on say the top 3 subjects you've been asked about or discussed amongst yourselves? that'd be good. that way we'd know what's occupying people's minds

Sythyr says to Nyoink Quixonte in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: Not for votes, I think not.

Sythyr grins at Nyoink Quixonte.

Elusive Spontiff DeNightshade tips his dark grey silk beret at Ronel stylishly.

DantheMan Dominare takes a deep breath

Sultan Githan says in Thieves' Cant with a Djelian accent: We're done here.

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: (spam incoming)

Faye Fi Fo Fam puts her fingers in her ears.

Nyoink Quixonte eeks.

Lexx Rehevkor wears a large emerald crystal.

DantheMan Dominare waits.

Nyoink Quixonte moves to hide, but trips over.

Elusive Galadriel says in Thieves' Cant with a Genuan accent: This is being logged still? :P

Evasive Akaishi says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: good

Sultan Githan says in Thieves' Cant with a Djelian accent: the meeting will end when everyone leaves the room :p

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: 'end' :p

Irixgero Dominare cowers in a corner from DantheMan Dominare.

DantheMan Dominare says in Thieves' Cant with a Morporkian accent: I never wanted to be a thief...

Galadriel has left the meeting.

Elusive Galadriel leaves down.